Using Ernie Baker’s 7 “S” Words to Assess Whether CIBC Is Truly BC

Our Focus

Here’s our focus today:

Using Ernie Baker’s 7-part assessment model, can Clinically-Informed Biblical Counselors legitimately claim to be part of the modern biblical counseling family?

Ernie and Dale

In an April 6, 2026 ACBC Truth in Love podcast, Dale Johnson interviewed Ernie Baker about the question, Is Clinically-Informed Biblical Counseling the Third Generation? In the podcast, Ernie and Dale concluded that:

Clinically-Informed Biblical Counseling (CIBC) is not the third generation of biblical counseling because CIBC is not truly biblical counseling.

Ernie and Dale stated that they wanted to address the question in an academic way rather than an argumentative way. They further said that they would use Ernie’s 7 “S” words in order to academically evaluate whether or not CIBC was actually biblical counseling. I’ll outline those “S” words in a moment.

Ernie and Bob

Ernie has been a dear friend for a quarter of a century. I like Ernie. I’ve stayed in his home. We’ve mutually ministered to each other multiple times.

I appreciate that Ernie and Dale did not want to be argumentative. I appreciate that they each said there were things they could learn from CIBC.

Still, I was disappointed in the podcast. Here’s why:

Ernie never biblically/academically documented a single “S” word claim that he made about CIBC not being BC. Ernie never quoted CIBC leaders. Rather, Ernie expressed his opinion and shared some second-hand stories about David Powlison.

I expected more. I expected an academic engagement with the actual academic writings of CIBC leaders.

Ernie, Dale, and Bob, and Advancing the Conversation

Dale concluded the podcast by saying he hoped “it at least forwards the conversation a little.” However, to forward the conversation we need either to have an actual conversation with a CIBC leader—where perhaps Erne and Dale interview a CIBC practitioner. Or, at the very least, Ernie and Dale quote and engage with CIBC writings.

So, my task today is to advance the conversation by:

Using Ernie’s 7 “S” words as a tool to non-argumentatively, but academically, assess the actual CIBC model.

Or, said another way, to mitigate their missing engagement, in today’s blog post/article I will:

Provide the missing engagement by asking Ernie’s 7 “S” questions and then quote various CIBC leaders from their public statements.

Bob and CIBC

I’ll do this as someone who is not a CIBC practitioner. You can learn why I do not use that label here:

Why I Don’t Call Myself a “Clinically-Informed Biblical Counselor” (CIBC).

You can learn how I do describe my biblical counseling approach here:

6 Biblical Counseling Convictions.

I’ll also do this as someone who believes that CIBC leaders like Jason Kovacs of Gospel Care Collective, and Jeremy Lelek of ABC, and Jonathan Holmes (now also the CCEF Executive Director) and Joe Hussung of Fieldstone Counseling, and Brad Hambrick, Kristin Kellen, Nate Brooks, Tate Cockrell, and Sam Williams of Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary (SEBTS) are biblical counselors.

Ernie’s 7 “S” Words

Ernie describes his 7 “S” words in several places, including:

His booklet, Biblical Counseling and The Psychologies.
His ACBC talk, Discerning What a Counseling System Really Believes. I’ll be taking Ernie’s definitions from this resource.

Here are Ernie’s 7 “S” words for assessing a counseling system:

Source of Authority: View of Knowledge/Epistemology. Is Scripture the ultimate source of authority or is there another ultimate source of authority?
Sin: View of What Is Wrong with Us/Hamartiology. What is the core problem that we face as human beings? What is our theory of what is wrong?
Solution (or Salvation, or Soul-u-tion): View of How People Change/Soteriology. What is the ultimate solution to our problem? Is the ultimate solution Christ and the gospel, or is the solution something else? What changes people?
Sanctification: View of How We Help People Change/Methodology. How do counselors seek to help people to change and grow?
Support System: View of Where Change and Equipping Happens. Where is counseling taught? Where is counseling practiced? Is the primary learning environment the church/para-church or the secular world?
Servants of the System: View of the Role of the Counselor/Practitioner. Are we disciplers, shepherds, soul physicians, and one-another ministers, or is there another controlling image of the soul care giver? (Also asks: Who “vets” and “certifies” the care-giver?)
Sparring: View of Apologetics. How we attempt to support and defend our convictions about what makes our system of care legitimate.

Conversations with CIBC Leaders

Ernie and Dale never identify any CIBC leaders. They never quote any of them. There are scores of CIBC leaders who self-identify as CIBC, and who have publicly stated what they believe.

If you want to learn about CIBC and CIBC practitioners, I’d invite you to read this introductory post:

15 Resources About Clinically-Informed Biblical Counseling (CIBC).

For today’s post, I’ll quote from several leading groups and individuals who have written and spoken publicly about their CIBC convictions. I’ll seek to overlay Ernie’s 7 “S” words onto their publicly documented views. That way, we can all evaluate whether or not these CIBC leaders are truly a part of the modern biblical counseling movement—according to Ernie’s own standard of assessment.

I’ll present this as a conversation with Ernie and Dale asking CIBC leaders to defend their approach as they respond to questions that Ernie derives from his 7 “S” words.

For the answer, I’ll use exact quotes from public documents from CIBC leaders.

Conversation #1: Source of Authority—What Is Our Source of Authority?

Imagine with me that Ernie and Dale have invited several CIBC leaders to be interviewed as part of the ACBC Truth in Love podcast. My friend, Ernie, rightly builds his foundation on scriptural authority and sufficiency. So, Ernie and Dale first ask their CIBC guests:

“Is Scripture your ultimate source of authority for your clinically-informed approach? Or do you believe that extra-biblical information, such as clinical theories and research and common grace findings are equal to or integrated in with Scripture as your ultimate authority?

Here are responses derived as verbatim quotes from public statements from SEBTS faculty members.

“The Bible is necessary, relevant, and authoritative for counseling. It is our only source for knowing the good news of the gospel that we might be reconciled to God and given new hearts (Rom 10:14- 15). Secular psychology can never serve as a replacement for biblical truth as God reveals in his Word: instruction, a divine perspective, and power essential for change that cannot be discovered elsewhere.”

“The Bible is sufficient for counseling. This sufficiency is seen in two ways. First, the Bible gives us all the divine inerrant verbal information we need to understand our spiritual and moral condition, know our God, and be reconciled to him. Nothing needs to be added to the message of the gospel of Jesus Christ, as if the Bible was lacking. Second, the Bible is sufficient to give us the wisdom necessary to live godly lives that represent God’s character and lead to human flourishing. To use language adopted from John Calvin, the Bible is a pair of spectacles that allow us to see the world through the eyes of God’s evaluation. RC/CIBCers therefore have everything necessary to evaluate common grace tools from every arena of life and establish their congruity or incongruity with God’s truth as the Holy Spirit leads God’s children in wisdom.”

“RC/CIBCers do not believe that the Bible’s sufficiency means that material outside of what is presented in the Scriptures is irrelevant or unimportant for counseling. To quote David Powlison, a ‘commitment to the sufficiency of Scripture does not hermetically seal the mind to all further input or interaction. Such commitment is a standpoint on the world, not a blindfold to the world.’” (Source: What Is Redemptive Counseling / Clinically Informed Biblical Counseling? A Paper by Nate Brooks, Tate Cockrell, Brad Hambrick, Kristin Kellen, and Sam Williams.)

Another leader chimes in, Jeremy Lelek from ABC.

“The official position of the Association of Biblical Counselors on the ministry of counseling is that the Bible possesses supreme authority as it regards mankind, human nature and motivation, the purpose and process of change, and man’s relationship to God. We recognize that secular attempts to answer the ultimate questions of psychology and counseling (i.e., Who is man? Why do people do what they do? How do people change? Why should a person change?) fall short in their answers since they do not acknowledge the reality of a personal God in whose presence mankind is always functioning and developing. The Bible is sufficient in constructing a comprehensive model of biblical counseling.”

“God’s Word Is Life: The Bible is inerrant and inspired by the living God. It is a fountain of living water that flows from the very heart of God. It consumes the barren soil of self-reliance, and promotes a harvest rooted in the worship of God eternal. It is from these ever-flowing waters that the River of Life, found in the person of Jesus Christ, is revealed. Sufficient for the most parched of souls, Christ alone is the Truth that sets us free.”

“Good theological training and doctrinal purity, we believe, are important to helping others learn and grow in biblical counseling ministry. In other words, we want Training Leaders to understand the gospel of Jesus Christ, know the Scripture well, develop theology from the Scripture, and lead others according to the truth.” (Source: ABC Mission and Beliefs.)

Using the language of David Powlison, and the imagery of John Calvin, Jason Kovacs of Gospel Care Collective directly explains how all-sufficient Scripture provides the biblical lens to assess any potential common grace information related to science and research:

“Clinically-informed as it relates to biblical counseling is an approach to counseling that addresses the whole person – body and soul. We believe that God created us as embodied souls and that he cares about our physical and spiritual wholeness. Through the Biblical lens we value the common-grace of scientific knowledge and seek to interpret and reinterpret the best of psychological research and clinical practice through a biblical worldview.” (Source: Gospel Care Collective FAQs.)

Note: The collated quotes in response to each Ernie’s seven “S” words are simply representative of scores of additional quotes I could include from CIBC leaders. This post could be 100-pages-long quoting what CIBC leaders say about the Bible as their source of authority, and about each of the other “S” categories.

Conversation #2: Sin—What Is Our Problem?

Ernie and Dale now ask their guests:

“What is your view of the problem? What is wrong with us? What is the core problem we face as human beings? Do you believe it is person sin? Or do you believe our brains make us do wrong? Or do you believe that external forces such as suffering, trauma, or society make us do wrong?”

Jeremy Lelek of ABC responds:

“Our Biggest Enemy is the Enemy Within: Mankind is naturally a slave to sin, and can by no means of his own power obtain salvation from God. Since the law of sin is perpetually at work within him, his attempts to obtain salvation by works or good deeds are futile.”

“Biblical counselors view human struggle from a model of depravity rather than a model of deprivation. Theoretical approaches that are built upon a deprivation model assume an individual’s emotional/mental condition is the direct consequence of unmet psychological needs, poor socialization, genetic predisposition, or emotional wounds. Such a view inherently classifies the human heart as neutral and/or passive. Biblical counselors, however, stress a model of depravity, and recognize the active, perpetual, and intentional influence of the law of sin on the heart of Man. Depravity is viewed as having an active role in thinking, emotion, perception, and living. This depravity always moves individuals away from God and towards self-indulged, self-seeking, and self-absorbed ways of living. Properly understood, the flesh is the greatest enemy with which an individual must contend within life and the counseling process.”

“If thinking, behavior, or emotions are classified as symptoms or ‘disorders’ according to secular models of psychology but are classified as sin according to Scripture then Biblical counselors are wise to address such thinking, behavior, or emotions according to a Biblical understanding while using Biblical terminology. This should always be done with an appropriate understanding on the part of the counselee as to the nature of sin, and how it contributes to their current issue(s). An emphasis on confession and living repentantly before God is essential. God’s grace should also be stressed as to avoid a legalistic or “self-help” mentality that would only serve to exacerbate a counselee’s presenting problem(s).”

“The chief aim of counseling non-believers is that they would be evangelized by the Gospel of Christ so that the fundamental change necessary for their life might occur.” (Source: ABC Mission and Beliefs.)

SEBTS faculty members concur, and add:

“RC/CIBC affirms that all people are both body and soul, with both our material and immaterial substances broken by sin and troubled by the effects of the fall. We share these commitments with both integrationists and nouthetic counselors. We affirm that the soul is the primary locus of human personality, and that the body cannot compel the soul to sin.”

“RC/CIBCers affirm that one of the purposes of the Bible is to address problems-in-living faced by human beings. In particular, God’s Word equips us to be conformed to the moral image of Christ (Rom 8:28-29; 1 John 3:1-3). Secular psychology can never serve as a replacement for biblical truth as God reveals in his Word: instruction, a divine perspective, and power essential for change that cannot be discovered elsewhere.” (Source: What Is Redemptive Counseling / Clinically Informed Biblical Counseling? A Paper by Nate Brooks, Tate Cockrell, Brad Hambrick, Kristin Kellen, and Sam Williams.)

Conversation #3: Solution (or Salvation, or Soul-u-tion)—What Changes People?

Ernie and Dale shift to “S” number three: “Solution.” They ask their podcast guests:

“What is your view of how people change? What is the ultimate solution to our sin problem? Is the ultimate solution Christ and the gospel, or is the solution something else?”

Jason Kovacs responds first.

“We do not offer a system or a three-step process for change but a person, a Redeemer, Jesus Christ. Through his life, death, resurrection, and ascension Jesus has forever dealt with our sin and perfectly shown the depths of God’s love for His children. God redeems and restores us back into right relationship with Himself, others, and the world through union with Christ. This Gospel reality – relational and eternal – shapes the change process and is foundational to our approach with our clients: (Source: Gospel Care Collective.)

His follow-up remarks combine answers to the first three “S” questions:

“Christ-centered biblical counseling is an approach to counseling that places Jesus Christ at the center of the therapeutic process. It recognizes the authority and sufficiency of the Bible as the foundation for understanding human nature, addressing personal struggles, and promoting spiritual growth. This counseling model acknowledges that all individuals are broken and in need of redemption, and that true healing comes through a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.”

Jeremy Lelek joins in.

“The Gospel of the Cross Alone Brings Peace: The Biblical message of sin, depravity, repentance, forgiveness and sanctification is built upon the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross and His glorious resurrection. Faith in Christ alone brings freedom from both the penalty and power of sin. Man is unable to find freedom or peace by himself or in himself. It is only in Christ that man can draw near to God, have his sins forgiven, receive the hope of eternal life and experience the protecting power of God in the midst of sin and the trials of life.”

“Without the Gospel of Jesus Christ, the human heart holds no power for transformation. It is through the finished work of Jesus Christ upon the Cross that humanity may obtain the privilege of personal relationship with God, and it is through the Gospel that the believer has everything needed for life change as understood in the doctrine of sanctification.”

“Grace is Sweet beyond Measure: Since mankind is bound by the law of sin and therefore helpless to satisfy the righteous requirements of the Law, God, who is full of mercy and love, sent his own Son, Jesus Christ, to pay the penalty of sin for all who, by faith, believe upon Him.”

“God Gloriously Transforms Lives: God continues His redemptive work in the life of the believer by progressively transforming him or her into the image of Jesus Christ. The Christian is instructed by Scripture to pursue holiness in God, and should seek to do so, however, the ultimate hope of the believer in transformation and persevering in the faith rests in the hands of the eternal God who assures completion of the work He alone initiated.” (Source: ABC Mission and Beliefs.)

Brad Hambrick shares his convictions about gospel-centered biblical counseling:

“The Necessity of the Gospel. To be a Christian is to have acknowledged one’s need for and professed faith in the gospel. Counseling that is Christian will point to the saving work of Jesus Christ as the ultimate solution for all sin-based and meaning-of-life struggles. The goal of the biblical counselor is to have gospel-centered conversations as frequently as possible. The setting of counseling or the spiritual openness of a counselee may impact the timing, frequency, or depth of these conversations.” (Source, What I Mean by Clinically-Informed Biblical Counseling?).

Conversation #4: Sanctification (Methodology)—How Do We Help People?

Having discussed the Bible as our source of authority, sin as the source of our central problem, and the gospel as the source of our only hope for change, Dale and Ernie next engage with CIBC leaders about the “S” of “sanctification.”

“How do you help people to change? How do you apply gospel truths to people’s lives? What is your actual practice of counseling? What is your methodology that you implement in counseling? I (Ernie) have described my approach as: ‘It’s submissive, practical, worship-oriented obedience as the Holy Spirit works in your life, and it’s helped by loving, one-another relationships in the body.’ How does that resonate with you?”

Jeremy Lelek volunteers to share his convictions about biblical methods of change—and his biblical/theological philosophy of change.

“In our methodology, we believe:”

“God, who made all things, exists and He alone, as the creator of all things, interprets the meaning of things and events. Being created in the image of God, we know that we are dependent on God for the truth. As sinners we suppress this knowledge and reinterpret the universe on the basis that we give all things and events their meaning. Special revelation, which not only informs us but, is also redemptive, is needed to deal with our hostile suppression of the truth. We will hear this redemptive word, the gospel of Christ, only as the Holy Spirit of God brings us to repentance and faith.”

“The whole counsel of God concerning all things necessary for his own glory, man’s salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down in Scripture, or by good and necessary consequence may be deduced from Scripture: unto which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelation of the Spirit or traditions of men.”

“Biblical counselors recognize that the chief understanding of change in those who are professed believers must be grounded in the doctrine of sanctification. If conformity to the image of Jesus Christ is not the central goal of change, then change itself must be viewed as merely superficial as it falls desperately short of Biblical transformation. Any system of psychology, “Christian” or otherwise, that fails to acknowledge and operate according to this supposition cannot by nature be categorized as Biblical counseling.”

“Biblical counselors believe that the primary element of transformation is not inherent in man but is given to him by God in the form of grace. Grace always propels individuals towards holiness, goodness, godliness, and righteousness. Without such grace, authentic soul change within the counseling process is unattainable.”

“Biblical counselors view human experience as always transpiring within the realm of God’s sovereignty. A believer’s suffering (physical or emotional) should not be viewed as arbitrary, but purposeful as it provides a context in which the Holy Spirit equips, empowers, and encourages people to live Christ in all things. Counseling that ignores the sovereignty of God in all circumstances is human-centric as it ultimately seeks to make sense of existential reality independent of the greater reality of God’s divine purposes.”

“All people need the counsel of God, which stands in direct contrast to the counsel of our own hearts, counsel of the world, and counsel of others who are conveying the wisdom of man rather than the wisdom of God. God’s wisdom is fundamentally different and antithetical to man’s wisdom. We receive counsel from God through His Word as the Holy Spirit illuminates and reveals truth. We receive/provide true counsel from/to others only as the counsel is shaped by and accurately reflects the counsel of God. Biblical counselors know that Scripture alone stands sufficient in providing a comprehensive understanding of the psychology of man and they do not mix or “integrate” any other false psychologies with the truth of God’s word.”

“Joyful living develops as people learn to live with a reverent fear of God, not by training counselees to place more trust and confidence in themselves. The secular concept of self-esteem stands in direct opposition to the “dying to self” message of the Gospel.” (Source: ABC Mission and Beliefs.)

The SEBTS faculty members add:

“On the Use of Scripture in Counseling Practice: The Bible is not just the foundation for counseling but is to be woven throughout the DNA of the counseling process. This commitment distinguishes us from integrationism, which tends to describe the Bible as the foundation for counseling yet may only infrequently use biblical truths explicitly in counseling. One study of self-described integrationists uncovered that only 13% used the Bible explicitly in counseling and only 3% used it in ‘critical moments’ in counseling.9 RC/CIBCers view such practice as withholding the very thing that was given to make humanity wise and give life (John 10:10; see commitment #1).”

“The best counseling available to human beings will always involve the message of the Scriptures woven throughout. RC/CIBCers will use the biblical text by reading it from the page, by paraphrase, and by implicit ideas. RC/CIBCers affirm David Powlison’s words regarding his training at Westminster Theological Seminary: ‘The theology and Bible courses were strikingly relevant to a young man who came with counseling questions and aspirations… Though most of the courses didn’t make ‘counseling applications’ in any detail, they were unmistakably about the ‘stuff’ counseling deals with.’”

“When we say that the Bible is part of the DNA of counseling, we mean that Scriptural truths and principles govern and guide all truly Christian counseling. Counseling given by RC/CIBCers must conform to the moral imperatives of Scripture, which are given to humanity for its flourishing. At the same time, the manner in which Biblical truths are applied will vary, based upon the counselee’s spiritual maturity and the role of the counselor (i.e., friend, small group leader, pastor, lay counselor, or licensed professional). While nouthetic counseling tends to place the exposition of Scripture at the center of counseling and integrationism tends to explicitly use the text of Scripture infrequently in counseling, RC/CIBCers seek to ascertain what method of engagement is most helpful for the client at the moment, following wisdom and discernment given by the Holy Spirit.” (Source: What Is Redemptive Counseling / Clinically Informed Biblical Counseling? A Paper by Nate Brooks, Tate Cockrell, Brad Hambrick, Kristin Kellen, and Sam Williams.)

Jason Kovacs describes CIBC as using the historic Christian means of grace:

“Christ-centered biblical counseling is grounded in biblical principles, teachings, and values emphasizing the importance of prayer, Scripture study, and reliance on the Holy Spirit. The focus is on helping individuals discover their identity in Christ, understanding God’s purposes and plans for their lives, and finding hope, forgiveness, and restoration through faith.” (Source, Gospel Care Collective FAQs.)

Conversation #5: Support System—What Is the Central Locus of Change and Equipping?

Ernie and Dale shift now to the “S” of “Support System.” They ask:

“Where do you think change and equipping best occur? Where is Christian living ‘caught’ and where is biblical counseling taught” What is the primary learning environment for counseling—the church/para-church, or the secular world?”

Brad Hambrick contributes his reflections and convictions:

“I believe in the centrality of the local church. People were made to live in community. This is part of what it means to be a healthy individual, when healthy is defined as living according to God’s design. Therefore, the biblical counselor will encourage participation in a local church. At times, however, formalized counseling provides advantages that temporarily serve a counselee better, or that a counselee is more willing to access, than one-another (e.g., befriending or community life) ministry in a local church or meeting with a pastor. Therefore, counselors in a formal setting play a legitimate and important role in caring for people.” (Source, What I Mean by Clinically-Informed Biblical Counseling?).

Jason Kovacs interacts next.

“We believe in church-partnering. God has forever existed in the community of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit and we, as His image bearers, are designed to live and thrive in community. Lasting, vibrant life change does not occur in isolation. God has purposed us to be formed and shaped in the context of a caring and consistent community. Therefore, we aim to do everything in connection with the church. This makes us unique to many other models.”

“We also believe in community-renewing. Our aim is to provide a level of care that enables everyone experiencing it to be equipped to live on the mission God has called them to locally and globally and to see our communities renewed by the power of the gospel. We also see the great need within our communities for healing and care for the ongoing impact of mental-illness and brokenness. We believe the gospel offers great hope spiritually and practically as we seek the wholeness of our communities.” (Source: Gospel Care Collective.)

Jeremy Lelek adds his biblical convictions about the locus of biblical counseling:

“Biblical counselors submit themselves and their counsel under the authority of the Church and its leadership. They seek to involve pastors/elders in the process of counseling as deemed necessary and appropriate by God’s Word. This would include areas such as support, discipleship, and church discipline.” (Source: ABC Mission and Beliefs.)

Conversation #6: Servants of the System—What Images Capture the Counselor’s Calling?

Next, Dale and Ernie address the role of the counselor. They ask:

“Are we disciplers, shepherds, soul physicians, and one-another ministers, or is there another controlling image of the soul care giver that you highlight as CIBC leaders?”

Jeremy Lelek explains his focus on the biblical counselor as a Christlike example of biblical love:

“Biblical counselors seek to radiate the joy of living a Christ-centered life. A dependence on God in prayer is a vital aspect of their lives and ministries. They seek to conduct themselves in a manner that brings glory and honor to God. They earnestly follow the same precepts of Scripture that are evident in their own counsel to others.”

“Biblical counselors seek to reflect the love, compassion, kindness, gentleness, and patience of Jesus Christ. They are called to be quick to listen, to encourage the timid and the weak, and to speak the truth in love. Should confrontation or rebuke be necessary, it should be done in a spirit of humility, remembering that authority to do so is not given based upon status, ability, or credentials, but because God’s grace alone has permitted them to speak such truth as His ambassadors and servants of the Kingdom.”

“Love is Key: All the Bible’s teachings may ultimately be summed up in two phrases according to Jesus: love God, and love your neighbor. This is the highest call to all who believe on the name of the Lord, Jesus Christ.” (Source: ABC Mission and Beliefs.)

Conversation #7: Sparring (Apologetics)—How Do You Defend Your Convictions?

Moving to their final “S” word, Dale and Ernie ask their guests:

“How do you defend your convictions? How do you support the legitimacy of your CIBC views?”

The SEBTS faculty members explain how they converse with others about their biblical counseling convictions:

“We aim to provide light and not heat in this article, as our purpose is to set forth ten essential commitments that we hold as professors at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary and believe RC/CIBCers from other institutions and ministries would likewise affirm. We will also attempt to show the historical and theological lineage of our position through occasional quotations from authors, theologians, and counselors who have been essential in its formation. We also write this not claiming to be the only voices involved in describing the RC/CIBC position. We do not mean to speak for others but aim to set forth our commitments as faculty members within the counseling department at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary. We hope that this document will prove helpful as a starting point for further conversation and development.”

“RC/CIBCers desire to learn from counselors to our north and to our south. (We use these terms because “left and right” tend to carry political and theological baggage.) We believe that integrationists can offer good counsel, and we believe that nouthetic counselors can offer good counsel. We believe that integrationists stop short of offering the best counseling available by relying too heavily on psychological tools and too lightly on the application of the biblical text into counseling. We believe that nouthetic counselors rely too exclusively on biblical exposition, leading them to focus predominantly on the moral elements of their clients’ struggles, often to the neglect of addressing the suffering dimension of a counselee’s hardship. However, we believe that God can and does use imperfect counseling – including imperfect counseling offered by RC/CIBCers – to affect heart change in his people, just as God uses theologically imperfect denominations and traditions to care well for his children.”

“On Ethos: RC/CIBCers view both integrationists and nouthetic counselors as brothers and sisters in the Lord who do much good. We celebrate one another’s successes and rejoice in the many truths that we hold in common. We aim to have our relationship to these two neighbors be like that of a friendly bond between like-minded Baptist and Presbyterian churches in the same city. We respect each other’s convictions, engage in healthy conversation, and seek to minister in our lane without making others’ lanes more difficult.” (Source: What Is Redemptive Counseling / Clinically Informed Biblical Counseling? A Paper by Nate Brooks, Tate Cockrell, Brad Hambrick, Kristin Kellen, and Sam Williams.)

Further Iron Sharpening Conversations

If we continued this imagined conversation, then:

Imagine if Ernie and Dale followed-up with additional questions…
Imagine if CIBC leaders followed-up with additional questions…
Imagine if Ernie and Dale found quotes they found more “controversial” or “concerning” and asked questions about those quotes from CIBC leaders…
Imagine if CIBC leaders found quotes from nouthetic biblical counseling leaders that they found “controversial” or “concerning” and asked questions about those quotes to Ernie and Dale…

Your Thoughts

Whether on “Team ACBC,” or “Team CIBC,” or, on neither “team,” now that you have read Ernie’s seven “S” categories and questions, and now that you have read a sampling of CIBC responses, what do you think?

Are clinically-informed biblical counselors a part of the family lineage of the modern biblical counseling movement?